Heavy duty motor and 4046 pll

[Viewmaster]

Steve (P) this is mainly aimed at you........

Now running a Unite Motor golf buggy 36v brushed DC motor.
MY1063-3
Rated at 7amps 180W and 2550 RPM.

Bought new from ebay for £30 including p/p

The motor drives my big induction motor, whose rotor is acting as a flywheel to give plenty of inertia.

The opto fork pulses have been cleaned with a cmos 4098 mono stable vibrator. o/p pulse length was at first too short and 4046 sq wave o/p was erratic.
Pulse length increased and it all locks up quickly every time into sync after about 2 secs settling down. No further pot adjustments required.

I choose the 4098 as it will take the positive going pulse straight from the opto, unlike the 555.

The opto and CD sync pulses do not have the missing 32nd pulse, as in my own application no frame locking is needed, just a smooth running
locked 3000RPM.
Under load the strobe light shows a slight shift, but the important thing for me is that it still locks firmly without wobble or hunting.

So the 4046 club circuit can lock very large motors OK.......thought you would like to know.

[Panrock]

Steve (P) this is mainly aimed at you........

Steve_P (Pendlebury) is a legendary figure. I hope it will be all right if Steve O can stand in for him for now...

Now running a Unite Motor golf buggy 36v brushed DC motor.
MY1063-3
Rated at 7amps 180W and 2550 RPM.
Bought new from ebay for £30 including p/p

That's a quarter-horsepower. Sounds good! Do you have an Ebay number or link? I'm interested in the output shaft length and diameter. 7 amps at 36 volts exceeds 180 watts, so I guess this motor (not unreasonably) doesn't like pulling flat out continuously.

Even if I have to build a 24v power supply to satisfy Steve_A's LED drivers, I'll be sure to use an independent supply for this motor! What power supply are you using?

The opto fork pulses have been cleaned with a cmos 4098 mono stable vibrator. o/p pulse length was at first too short and 4046 sq wave o/p was erratic.
Pulse length increased and it all locks up quickly every time into sync after about 2 secs settling down. No further pot adjustments required.

I choose the 4098 as it will take the positive going pulse straight from the opto, unlike the 555.

Useful tip. I have often used monostables in the past with NBTV. As I understand it, it is the edges rather than the pulse lengths which are important when triggering the 4046, so maybe your nice juicy pulses now have cleaner edges.

So the 4046 club circuit can lock very large motors OK.......thought you would like to know.

Yes. I can't see why things can't be simply scaled up in this way. Even though these large assemblies will have more inertia, the motor driving and correcting pulses will be beefier to match.

Steve O

[Viewmaster]

Now running a Unite Motor golf buggy 36v brushed DC motor.
MY1063-3
Rated at 7amps 180W and 2550 RPM.
Bought new from ebay for £30 including p/p

That's a quarter-horsepower. Sounds good! Do you have an Ebay number or link? I'm interested in the output shaft length and diameter. 7 amps at 36 volts exceeds 180 watts, so I guess this motor (not unreasonably) doesn't like pulling flat out continuously.
Steve O

Try this as typical
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Electric-Scoo ... 2568893b57

Just google for either "24v motor" or 36v Motor" etc on all subjects.
Mine has run for 15 mins and only gets warm.....NOT hot !!
My shaft was 5/16 dia and 1 inch long with as gear which I removed.

Even if I have to build a 24v power supply to satisfy Steve_A's LED drivers, I'll be sure to use an independent supply for this motor! What power supply are you using?
Steve O

A no frills job.
(that's all I can understand to build !
Simply a largish 30v toroidal TX with a bridge rect. and C's
A seperate 12v supply for the chips etc........ and other fish to fry

I spent a week trying to solve why it was all erratic. Incorrect circuit tracks/dry joints/ frigging the 4046 pll components back and forth etc.
It would lock OK then wander. Re lock and unlock again and again.
It was that too short pulse. Once it was slightly lengthened all was fine.

Bear in mind again that I am using all 32 line pulses, both from the cd and the opto. How it would all run with the missing 32nd pulse I know not, but I see no reason why it shouldn't be OK.

I would try this for you but my sync wheel only has 8 sync holes in it (runs at 3000RPM) so cannot yet just blank off 32nd with tape.

[gary]

Try this as typical
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Electric-Scoo ... 2568893b57

Interesting, I have the exact same model motor but it is rated 300 Watts 24 V 16.5 A : http://secure.oatleyelectronics.com//pr ... 0572dd8b20

I run this from the 5V of a small computer power supply (the 12V is a puny 4 amps) and it runs infuriatingly just under 750 RPM, but as I use it on my camera it's good enough (I use software based TBC).

It does imply though that using the 12 V output of a decent sized computer power supply should give 1500 RPM with some "headroom", anyway if you had one laying around or could scrounge one it might be worth a try.

Those lovely toroidal TXs are alas too rich for this poor boys palate...

[Steve Anderson]

I run this from the 5V of a small computer power supply (the 12V is a puny 4 amps) and it runs infuriatingly just under 750 RPM....

Depending on the voltage and current required I find sealed lead-acid batteries ideal when you need a lot of current*, albeit for not the greatest length of time. Here I buy them from a local motorcycle outlet. As they're generally made in Thailand they tend to be quite cheap. My UPS uses a 12V 7AH version which costs around seven quid and has a life of around 3 years before it dies...and that's due to the average temperature here. In an European climate I would expect a few years more.

A charger is either easily knocked up...see the LM317 datasheet, or purchased.

When they do expire I use them as doorstops...

Steve A.

* DO NOT use SLABs without a fuse in the circuit, or you WILL have a fire one day, believe me...

[gary]

My UPS uses a 12V 7AH version which costs around seven quid.

Nice one Steve, cherish that. Heavy duty batteries (I include the aforementioned battery in that category) are ideal especially for experimental work as you can immediately rule out some of those pesky power supply issues. Alas, you can add an order of magnitude to your price here, I don't really know what happened but around about 2006 my car battery (small) went up from $50 to $120 (as an example). I don't like to get political on this forum (alright yes I do ) this seemed to coincide with the rise in influence of the Commu... sorry, Greens party in this country, and may have something to do with a kind of tax to reduce usage...

[Viewmaster]

[quote="gary]Those lovely toroidal TXs are alas too rich for this poor boys palate...[/quote]

Ah well, I treated myself as I don't smoke, don't drink, and haven't been on a holiday for over 20 years.
..........and haven't had an expensive girl friend for over 60

[gary]

and haven't had an expensive girl friend for over 60

I tend to buy cheap tools and components etc, that way if they break it doesn't break your heart or your wallet. Apropos of nothing...

[Steve Anderson]

...you can immediately rule out some of those pesky power supply issues....

That is true but with a PSU you can slowly wind up the voltage via a Variac and shut off the power if things start to evaporate. Any decent variable bench supply should have a current limit on it which SLABs DO NOT!

But if your bench PSU limits at 3A (mine do) and you need 7A there's not much choice but to use batteries or build another PSU to suit...you might have to anyway for the final application.

It's the old trade-off situation.

Steve A.

[gary]

Any decent variable bench supply should have a current limit on it which SLABs DO NOT!

True, but a current limiter is an easy and relatively cheap "extra" that can be built if desired.

I am not lucky enough to own a bench power supply, but a PSU from a computer shuts down gracefully if excessive current is drawn - of course that is fine for the protection of the PSU - not so much for the circuit under test (or what ever) though.

A Variac? now THAT is definitely a luxury! drool.

[Steve Anderson]

A Variac? now THAT is definitely a luxury! drool.

I picked one up in Singapore (new) about ten years ago. I spotted it in a shop window covered in dust with a ridiculously low price tag. It was the only one they had and had been sitting there for years. I don't recall what I paid for it but it was a raving bargain!

I wasn't in the market for one but it has come in more useful than I expected, especially on tube/valve circuitry and other high voltage stuff.

But it did blow my baggage allowance upon my return flight to Bangkok!

Steve A.

I didn't realize how expensive they were! A similar one from Farnell UK is over 200 quid (plus plus). I think I may have paid around a tenner for it.

Edit...I just had a look at it, it still has the price sticker on it. It was 65 Singapore Dollars which is about 32 quid at today's exchange rate...still a bargain!

[gary]

I may have paid around a tenner for it.

Definitely a great bargain!