Team Prometheus help wanted with NBTV link

Forum for discussion of electronic television. Generally, stuff to do with CRTs and not using mechanical displays.

Postby Monroe Lee King Jr. » Wed Feb 19, 2014 12:15 am

The 2 stage rocket is a class N booster to another class N booster. The rocket in the glider is a Class J

There is a parachute however the goal is to land back at the launch site as a plane. The parachute is a safety measure.

The Current X-11E to be flown is April will again be redesigned pending the results of this first test.

The X-12A is the designation for the final prototype and it is on the drawing board.

Details of the NBTV system are up in the air right now as I do not know enough to give them. We need a system that can transmit 250 miles ideally and use the least amount of power possible.

The Frequency need to be in a range we can construct an antenna of a size that will fit the spacecraft. so I'm saying 400 Mhz - Up

The banwith can be and will I expect 10 khz or above.
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Postby Harry Dalek » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:54 pm

I am sure others can answer NBTV Questions better than yours truly .
But from the sounds of it you need to convert your camera ATV system which must be tiny to 30 line 60 line .

I suppose being an electronic system it would be good depending on how close and how far away your rocket plane is to be able to change your television resolution so bandwidth can narrow and resolution can drop with distance ...bit beyond my head processor but i would do that if i could .

So if you want a narrow bandwidth analog system i can see your goal being to find a systems converter that can be and miniaturized.

I read the other day a pilot was trying to stop the balloon experiments which even kids are doing now as he is worried they might bring a plane down if its sucked into the engine.
What gets me on the balloons when they drop back to earth it seems they are never far from where they were sent up when we loose a kids balloon here it looks to me like you might be lucky if you could find it again in the next state . :shock:
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Postby Monroe Lee King Jr. » Thu Feb 20, 2014 6:59 am

Is there any software available that can convert a camera image to NBTV in real time that can be used to then transmit the signal?

At the same time is there receiving software that can receive the signal and display it in real time?

Monroe
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Postby Harry Dalek » Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:19 pm

Monroe Lee King Jr. wrote:Is there any software available that can convert a camera image to NBTV in real time that can be used to then transmit the signal?

At the same time is there receiving software that can receive the signal and display it in real time?

Monroe


Well most stuff is done on the Pc these days and i have used Doms software for part of what evers on the the screen to nbtv in real time ...not really what you want .There is also live NBTV via Garys software.

I think you need something like Steves system converter there are more than likely others but because of the size you have.... it is a problem .

Apart from a systems converter a NBTV camera is only other way i can think of but i can't think of any one making a soild state version off hand
every one either makes a camera tube or mechanical camera both would be to large for your little rocket plane .


Have you tried just dropping the bandwidth on your receivers as i said it works for analog satellite receiving .
might be an easy fix for now .
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Postby Monroe Lee King Jr. » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:20 pm

Someone I have met on the #highaltitude irc channel I know only as fsphil has successfully done this with a Raspberry Pi using a small 10mw transmitter chip. The receiver is a Funcube SDR (software Defined Radio) connected to the PC and he is transmitting and receiving in real time.

I believe he has 48 lines of resolution and is using a 320 line average camera (like webcam) for input on the Raspberry Pi. He has written his own software so I can't replicate it myself. I was here looking for help and advice to solve this issue.

He did tell me and you can see in the video he does have a slight vertical sync issue and he is working on that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGgmCiJ9iEM
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Postby Harry Dalek » Thu Feb 20, 2014 2:40 pm

Hi it looks like it works well, i think gary would be happy seeing hes software used on this .

You would not only have a rocket plane record but a NBTV one as well for this project
:wink:
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Postby Monroe Lee King Jr. » Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:22 pm

Who is Gary? If this is his software I need to find him.

Monroe
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Postby Harry Dalek » Fri Feb 21, 2014 10:06 am

Monroe Lee King Jr. wrote:Who is Gary? If this is his software I need to find him.

Monroe


Heres Garys web site and you can download he's programs here ,they used he's Big Picture.

You can use it for a camera live or nbtv file.

You can PM him here but he is busy at the moment so you might not get a reply for a while .

BTW the ctrl key and D key run the nbtv file or live video if your trying to work out why its not working

http://users.tpg.com.au/users/gmillard/nbtv/nbtv.htm
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Postby Monroe Lee King Jr. » Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:59 pm

Hohn Logie Baird is he on this forum? Thanks for the link! I'm looking for something that can run on Linux and I think this fella Hohn Logie Baird has something useable.

If I had the source code for the windows software perhaps it could be recompiled for linux if I can get a hold of Gary.

Thanks again

Monroe
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Postby Harry Dalek » Sat Feb 22, 2014 4:47 pm

Monroe Lee King Jr. wrote:Hohn Logie Baird is he on this forum? Thanks for the link! I'm looking for something that can run on Linux and I think this fella Hohn Logie Baird has something useable.

If I had the source code for the windows software perhaps it could be recompiled for linux if I can get a hold of Gary.

Thanks again

Monroe


Now are you having us on ?

I think old Jonh logie Baird might be into linux if it were not for the fact its hard he being into hes 100's and dead ... good luck contacting him .
Gary is more a PC windows Bloke i think....but he is alive last i heard .
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Postby Monroe Lee King Jr. » Sun Feb 23, 2014 2:57 am

No sorry I did a search on NBTV linux and found this website http://www.hffax.de/html/software.htm I thought the name was connected with a linux version of the software the links on the site are dead unfortunately and so is the fella I guess.

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Postby Harry Dalek » Sun Feb 23, 2014 10:01 am

Monroe Lee King Jr. wrote:No sorry I did a search on NBTV linux and found this website http://www.hffax.de/html/software.htm I thought the name was connected with a linux version of the software the links on the site are dead unfortunately and so is the fella I guess.

Monroe


Well i suppose not every one knows the person who invented the first working tv system if you never knew .

I am not sure there is much for NBTV on lunix others might know but i don't think there is and nothing as good as Garys software and Dominic Beesleys.
http://authorityfile.co.uk/NBSC/article ... ?section=1

Hes does play back and record what evers on a part of the screen .

Garys is more what you want live view any case its all free /

I think you will be going to a dead end looking for nbtv Lunix copy of any thing like garys windows software.
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Postby Monroe Lee King Jr. » Sun Feb 23, 2014 10:23 am

Then it will have to be recompiled or re-written to serve our purpose. Nope didn't know that learning more every day!

Flying a windows compatible pc is not possible for us at this time. We need realtime O/S to run windows would be to carry some extra weight for not enough reason.

Monroe
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Postby Harry Dalek » Sun Feb 23, 2014 4:37 pm

Monroe Lee King Jr. wrote:Then it will have to be recompiled or re-written to serve our purpose. Nope didn't know that learning more every day!

Flying a windows compatible pc is not possible for us at this time. We need realtime O/S to run windows would be to carry some extra weight for not enough reason.

Monroe


No worries ...Most people here are interested in NBTV are interested more on the early forms of television than newer forms of narrowband versions as we would all be doing a form of digital NBTV apart from the PC side of things for viewing and recording which makes things easier testing the analog DIY gear.

I wonder if a Windows Emulators for Linux might work to run Garys software ? i

Heres another site might be of interest but again windows based

http://taggart.glg.msu.edu/nbtv/nbtvcpu.htm
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Postby DrZarkov » Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:26 pm

The NBSC Software (NTSC colour on NBTV) runs in Java: http://www.authorityfile.co.uk/NBSC/dow ... fault.aspx

NBSC is fully compatible to b/w NBTV.
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