Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

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Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

Postby OmegaProductions » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:16 am

Hello guys in NBTV! :D

Well...today is just off-topic, but I'm talking about Pallophotophone (or sound-on-film). It's one of those systems that have sound waves directly onto film. It was mainly used in radio broadcasting in the 1920s to the 1930s. I was interested in it a year ago in 2016. But anyways...here are some of the pictures of the Pallophotophone. :)
Pallophotophone.jpg

Pallophotophone machine.jpg


That's all I had to say guys! Goodbye guys! :D :) :wink:
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Re: Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

Postby OmegaProductions » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:19 am

I did some of the drawings. It shows an old methods and the new methods of the Pallophotophone system. :)
And here it is... :D
Pallophotophone drawing (04th-11-2017).png

Homemade Pallophotophone camera drawing (05th-11-2017).png
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Re: Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

Postby Klaas Robers » Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:53 pm

In the 30's we at Philips Research had the Philips Miller System. Look at http://www.orbem.co.uk/tapes/pm.htm to read what it was and see some photographs of the system. It used black film, where a cutter removed a line in the black layer. The cutter moved vertically and thus a clear path with a variable width was cut. Reading was done optically.

As you can read, the BBC used it quite some time. It was practical for broadcast, as you can easilly edit the sound, just like film. During WW2 the Lab did experiments with stereophony, using simply two cutters next to each other. The sound quality was amazingly good, I heard that my former collegues made a recording of marching German soldiers over the street along the research lab, with two microphones in two open windows. That recording should still exist.

The advantage is / was that you cannot erase the sound, so there is more kept from the past.
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Re: Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

Postby OmegaProductions » Tue Nov 07, 2017 6:02 am

Hhuunmmmm...very interesting! :?

That system you just showed me looked very unique. Why is it unique? Because the RCA's Pallophotophone has a lamp to blink brighter and dimer though the lens to the advancing film to show up sound waves, well that's how it works. But Philips-Miller Film Recorder, well...compared to the flickering lamp to show up waves, this one is like a phonograph, were it cuts grooves, expect...it cuts optical sound waves! wow! :o

But thanks for the post! :D :) :wink:
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Re: Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

Postby Klaas Robers » Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:51 pm

Indeed, that is what it does. So it needs no photpgraphic devellopment before you can have play back. Just like magnetic tape recording years later. That is why BBC used it in the 30's. I will ask if some of this equipment is still existing in the Philips museums.
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Re: Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

Postby Lowtone » Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:16 am

It seems to be basically the same system that was/is use in cinéma with 35mm sound film.
There is an audio track, wich is analog and optical, but the rest of the film is used for other datas like digital sound and analog picture.
Maybe it is possible to build one with different cameras or projectors parts.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bP_Y42shtPk[/youtube]
someone tried a simple experimental version
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Re: Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

Postby OmegaProductions » Fri Nov 10, 2017 3:27 am

Lowtone wrote:It seems to be basically the same system that was/is use in cinéma with 35mm sound film.
There is an audio track, wich is analog and optical, but the rest of the film is used for other datas like digital sound and analog picture.
Maybe it is possible to build one with different cameras or projectors parts.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bP_Y42shtPk[/youtube]
someone tried a simple experimental version


I actually seen this video! It was interesting but it only didn't work because the sound waves are green and it is dim to the phototransistor. If you make it white, or if you have an oscilloscope, then use black and white film. It would look brighter to your phototransistor playback device. (and of course, phototransistor is used for homemade mechanical TV cameras!) :D :)
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Re: Pallophotophone (sound-on-film)

Postby Lowtone » Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:55 am

Exact. On cinema films, the wave is white on black background. I made some "experimental cinema" art pièces, one consists of scratching horizontal lines, including on the sound track, result stunned the audience :mrgreen:

Since a bit more than a decade they made films with "blue" sound. It's still white but on bright blue background. This cyan background needs a red laser to scan it.
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