Inductionvisor

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Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Fri Mar 17, 2017 6:13 pm

I am starting to knock together a crude Led Nipkow which will be powered modulated by Induction more just want to see if it will work ,i mentioned it a while back here .
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2075&p=18281&hilit=wireless+led#p18281

Now i know the problem of a normal Led is its lens but i happen to have just the right amount for a quick knock up 32 line lens less Led disk which might be good enough for the job .....well i am going to try this time only for a proof of concept ,i had a spare bead disk nipkow which i can see has a few mistakes but good enough here for testing .
Being lazy all the leds will be lighting up .
2 ways of doing this ,a coil for each led and you have an induction mask each led .... part of one above or below it would partly light also i think .....like the light spill over from a light box ...
i am going for one receiving coil rotating in the center other coil the transmitting one lined up ...the result i would think is a number of rasters around the disk .....could have a another black disk infront with a mask slot cut out blank out the others if you could be bothered /
There's a cap needed to tune in the circuit on the receiving coil the leds all just light on 1 volt so should be workable double that /
I will just use a 555 oscillator running at 20 to 40 khz and NBTV modulate via its pin 5 ... pin 3 to a power transistor to the transmitting coil ...motor speed will just be a lm317 manual control .
The size of the LED point is smaller than what my camera can focus to its smaller than whats showing up Still i am more interested in if i can modulate them than the idea of this as a whole working monitor .
Just a little experiment its not as elegant as a bead or lens disk and i am sure some one has used the idea for a pov display more than likely .
Any one tried it for NBTV just know i haven't yet .
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Last edited by Harry Dalek on Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby gary » Fri Mar 17, 2017 11:31 pm

Well sort of, what you have is basically a "fire wheel" (v21-1, v23-3), but I think your proposed means of illuminating the LEDs is unique.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Sat Mar 18, 2017 4:21 pm

gary wrote:Well sort of, what you have is basically a "fire wheel" (v21-1, v23-3), but I think your proposed means of illuminating the LEDs is unique.


Gary i will check those newsletters out ,i suppose they used commutators of some sort ,i always found trying this very noisy may be because i am not that good at making them and stuff in general .
This is some thing i want to try and tick it off my list ,just have to make the 555 circuit such as the circuit below but i will make it variable to tune in my transmitter to led receiver coil for best results.
pretty very similar to some rotary transformer but in this case powering and signaling the Leds.
I have the motor and nipkow on a little test bed and i can use my bench variable supply for simple motor speed .see if i can knock together the rest of it soon.
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The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby gary » Sat Mar 18, 2017 4:31 pm

I should point out that you will find the "fire wheels" made by NBTV people have the leds behind the normal apertures, otherwise the lines are too wide - but it'll be interesting to see what this shows when you get it going.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Sat Mar 18, 2017 4:51 pm

gary wrote:I should point out that you will find the "fire wheels" made by NBTV people have the leds behind the normal apertures, otherwise the lines are too wide - but it'll be interesting to see what this shows when you get it going.


Hi Gary it did cross my mind but mounting wise this was easier and i am not expecting this rejected nipkow will produce great images as is ,this little test bed is more seeing if the rotary signaling will work and perhaps in the future i will take more time an make some thing better .
I think the size of the Led surface might be small enough but yes we will see
I will have to see if how i go with the transmitting and receiving coils as below (turn sound down unless you enjoy this :wink: ) seems to work well just on the power side lighting leds .

youtu.be/VVjht68uCKs
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby gary » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:03 pm

The other problem (and perhaps the main one) is that the illuminated part of the LED isn't necessarily on centre, but yeah, this is a good experiment.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:40 pm

gary wrote:The other problem (and perhaps the main one) is that the illuminated part of the LED isn't necessarily on centre, but yeah, this is a good experiment.

Yes that would be a problem and a problem for this one as i am sure most of the holes are way off i find making the larger holes harder this Nipkow was in the rejected bin ...i think i should of worked my way up drill sizes when increasing the hole but if its off from the start that will not help either ..
So far Gary knocking the circuit up quick this afternoon and playing around with the frequency and one set of coils i have managed to light the leds ....the modulating of the leds will sure work this way ...just as you say other factors such as lining the leds up size of the led surface surrounding light for this way i mounted the leds.... but modulation wireless this way seems ok .

I have to add the coil to the nipkow and mount the transmitting coil above it a few mm for maximum transfer ...only made as i said one set of coils 6 turns of 0.4mm wire 25g ? size and turns i have just lucked it to this point ...seeing others power transfer mine is very average but looks to be more than enough to power the 32 leds.
I was modulating with Steves reversing NBTV reversing wav for this test


youtu.be/j-AeCX8MvQs
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby gary » Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:53 pm

Great start Harry.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Mon Mar 20, 2017 5:00 pm

gary wrote:Great start Harry.


Thanks Gary i had a bit of time this afternoon so did a touch more on it enough to give it a test run ,You were right on the led surface being to large i can make out movement but theres a total lack of detail .
Least the transfer of power and modulating the Leds works .

youtu.be/YjpNkAzbmi0

youtu.be/RLANSo62NM8
I will work on the Led side i need to change the amount of light coming from each Led ,if thats pancaking another nipkow above it or covering each led with foil and a pin prick hole or painting them ,have a think about it ...
I did choose random wav i should of looked for an easier letter or shape NBTV wav least its a start goal now is just to see some thing i can make out then i will be happy .
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The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Thu Mar 23, 2017 1:53 pm

Changed the Inductionvisor Nipkow i took on Garys suggestion on placing the leds behind the nipkow holes i have no speed control yet just me turning the power supply on and off and it still needs tweaking but i can start to see stuff now better than yesterday :wink:
I did try a thin black cardboard disk over the old idea but didn't work well .

youtu.be/fcgY1taYMiM
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The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby gary » Thu Mar 23, 2017 6:00 pm

You seem to be getting there Harry.

Your LEDs *should* be much brighter though - you may have to turn up your driving signal to 11! ;-)
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:19 pm

gary wrote:You seem to be getting there Harry.

Your LEDs *should* be much brighter though - you may have to turn up your driving signal to 11! ;-)



Yes Gary leds behind the Nipkow have sure dropped the light levels lucky the camera is better than my eyes i can just see me trying try sync it for a short time .

I will have to tinker some more theres a few things i can try now the hardware pretty much will work as is /
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:14 pm

Got some video tests done today perhaps as i say on my video comments not the best monitor ever made far far from it and i know that but a proof of concept that i could power the Nipkow Leds and modulate them same time wireless method.
First video is Bairds head side ways and The NBTV letters test card if any thing should be able to make that out ..lost sync end of video sorry
I ended up putting on a LM317 to make the motor speed adjustable...
I tried many times to try and take photos but kept missing the frames these were the partial results top of image in focus ...Oh well
Jotting down here what i think of a led disk to be honest its best viewed bit off side to a direct view i found it similar to a mirror monitor a touch hash to view direct .....more than likely the size, i am using it at full power to view the leds with less room light and using a bigger disk would help /
I only really wanted here to see if the idea of a wireless power and modulation would work on NBTV Nipkow and it does work so if any thing i am happy with that a tick for my done list now :wink:
OH i forgot to mention i increased the transmit and receive coils from 6 turns to 12 turns doubled the power that sure worked
Modulation to pin 5 of the 555 you can either use direct dc or ac coupling these tests today were DC
The power transistor should be largest you have and heat sink it and use a large sink also it runs very hot my heat sink is to little small for any long run of this .

youtu.be/ugzyBL9i8wU
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Last edited by Harry Dalek on Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Harry Dalek
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby gary » Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:04 pm

It's reminding me of how difficult it was to video my bead disk, nothing I could come up with did it justice.
Perfecting an NBTV system is like trying to slam a revolving door...
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Re: Inductionvisor

Postby Harry Dalek » Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:49 pm

gary wrote:It's reminding me of how difficult it was to video my bead disk, nothing I could come up with did it justice.


Yes Gary not easy to take pictures pretty much useless today , i didn't have my other camera to try which would of given better results this ones not good for NBTV shutter speed i suppose . :roll:
The electromagnetic spectrum has no theoretical limit at either end. If all the mass/energy in the Universe is considered a 'limit', then that would be the only real theoretical limit to the maximum frequency attainable.
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Harry Dalek
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